reedsburgsports
In reading the article in the Reedsburg Times Press ([link=http://www.wiscnews.com/rtp/sports/459267]http://www.wiscnews.com/rtp/sports/459267[/link]),

Let me state what happened:

Top of the seventh the Reedsburg Pirates lead 3-0 over the Cazenovia Reds. The bases are loaded with one out. A Pirate batter is hit by the pitch and awarded first base. The Reds' players and fans complained the batter leaned into the pitch, allowing the ball to hit him. The umpires met and after the discussion, the batter was called back to home plate and all three Reedsburg base runners were returned to their original spots. This led to an argument between the Pirates' coach and home plate umpire. The article goes on to state: Pirates' coach stated:
"I was arguing what the home plate umpire told me. He said you have to make an attempt to get out of the way of a pitch, which you do not. So that was my argument and the fact that base umpire over-turned it, didn't make me too happy."

However, unless there is a difference in the rules of Major League Baseball and the rules in the Home Talent League, rule 6.08 for The Batter states the following:

6.08 The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base without liability to be put out (provided he advances to and touches first base) when -- (a) Four balls have been called by the umpire; Rule 6.08(a) Comment: A batter who is entitled to first base because of a base on balls must go to first base and touch the base before other base runners are forced to advance. This applies when bases are full and applies when a substitute runner is put into the game. If, in advancing, the base runner thinks there is a play and he slides past the base before or after touching it he may be put out by the fielder tagging him. If he fails to touch the base to which he is entitled and attempts to advance beyond that base he may be put out by tagging him or the base he missed.
(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched.

Can anyone tell me which of the two were correct in this?

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hoopdreamswi
I think (2) makes it very clear. He is not awarded first base if he makes no attempt to avoid the pitch. The coach is incorrect.

The umpires should have made a quicker decision without having to consult each other. If either ump would have made the call right away, they may not have liked it, but it wouldn't have evolved into a discussion and an argument.

This ruling occurs in college baseball all the time where there's a lot of guys who gladly get hit with pitches.
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jtownsupporter
i woulda went nuts if i was called back in that situation especially if the base ump over rulled the home plate umpire. just my feeling on that.
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Quote 0 0
derek_old
del wrote:


In reading the article in the Reedsburg Times Press ([link=http://www.wiscnews.com/rtp/sports/459267]http://www.wiscnews.com/rtp/sports/459267[/link]),

Let me state what happened:

Top of the seventh the Reedsburg Pirates lead 3-0 over the Cazenovia Reds. The bases are loaded with one out. A Pirate batter is hit by the pitch and awarded first base. The Reds' players and fans complained the batter leaned into the pitch, allowing the ball to hit him. The umpires met and after the discussion, the batter was called back to home plate and all three Reedsburg base runners were returned to their original spots. This led to an argument between the Pirates' coach and home plate umpire. The article goes on to state: Pirates' coach stated:
"I was arguing what the home plate umpire told me. He said you have to make an attempt to get out of the way of a pitch, which you do not. So that was my argument and the fact that base umpire over-turned it, didn't make me too happy."

However, unless there is a difference in the rules of Major League Baseball and the rules in the Home Talent League, rule 6.08 for The Batter states the following:

6.08 The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base without liability to be put out (provided he advances to and touches first base) when -- (a) Four balls have been called by the umpire; Rule 6.08(a) Comment: A batter who is entitled to first base because of a base on balls must go to first base and touch the base before other base runners are forced to advance. This applies when bases are full and applies when a substitute runner is put into the game. If, in advancing, the base runner thinks there is a play and he slides past the base before or after touching it he may be put out by the fielder tagging him. If he fails to touch the base to which he is entitled and attempts to advance beyond that base he may be put out by tagging him or the base he missed.
(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched.

Can anyone tell me which of the two were correct in this?



I'm guessing it's an unwritten rule that it is the umpires discretion.
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wiggum
Did the base umpire make the over-ruled call or the plate umpire change his after collaborating with him? That is another common misconception that an ump can over rule another ump. They can ask each other for help and then make a call, but if they don't, they can't just over rule each other as is stated in rule 9.02 (b) & (c). I have seen this happen alot as fans and coaches think the home plate ump can over rule the base ump on any call. I saw a high school team's season end because this was handled improperly as the home plate ump changed the field umps call on a play at 1st, which extended an inning and allowed the go ahead runs to score. These gentlemen doing the game were definately vets of the game and I was suprised they allowed this procedure to happen. Only the umpire who made the initial call can change it, the coach only appealed to the home plate ump and he changed it, what a shame.
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cncsion
The most moronic rule in baseball, this is worse than a balk. Thankfully outside of highschool not many umps call it. It shouldn't be called in high school either.

It's the pitcher's responsibility to put the ball in the strike zone, or to get guys swinging at pitches out of it. If he puts the ball at the batter why the HE DOUBLE HOCKEY STICKS is the responsibility put on the batter to get out of the way. Hell we award batters for OBP and yet one of the easiest ways to get on has this moronic asterisk next to it.
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