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kenny78
I will have to read that report. Thanks for the tip!
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db11
Probably a dumb question, but does this report include walk-ons?
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bp11
2004 class- Sharif chambliss graduated, Michael Flowers graduated, Greg Stiemsma NBA not sure but pro ball, Deaaron Williams left program.

2005 class- Joe Krabbenhoft graduated, Marcus Laundry pro ball, Mickey Perry transfer, Morris Cain graduated, Kevin Gullikson graduated

2006 class- Jason Bohannon graduated, J.P. Gavinski graduated, Trevon Hughes pro ball did not graduate that I'm aware, Brett Valentyn graduated

2007 class- Tim Jarmusz graduated, Jon Leuer no clue NBA, Nankivil no clue pro ball, Wquinton Smith graduated

Looks like Laundry and Hughes are the only two black players to stay at Wisconsin and not graduate. There are also 4 that graduated and not zero. Although Chambliss probably doesn't count in this report as he transferred in.
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dawgstyle
db11 wrote:
Probably a dumb question, but does this report include walk-ons?

No. Its only scholarship players. That is what the NCAA tracks.
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bp11
dawgstyle wrote:
db11 wrote:
Probably a dumb question, but does this report include walk-ons?

No. Its only scholarship players. That is what the NCAA tracks.


Do players that leave the program count against you?
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dawgstyle
bp11 wrote:
dawgstyle wrote:
db11 wrote:
Probably a dumb question, but does this report include walk-ons?

No. Its only scholarship players. That is what the NCAA tracks.


Do players that leave the program count against you?

I don't think transfers do. I believe if kids just fail out they would.
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traviswilson
dawgstyle wrote:
bp11 wrote:
dawgstyle wrote:
db11 wrote:
Probably a dumb question, but does this report include walk-ons?

No. Its only scholarship players. That is what the NCAA tracks.


Do players that leave the program count against you?

I don't think transfers do. I believe if kids just fail out they would.

If players are in good academic standing when they transfer, they do not hurt you. If they are not in good academic standing, then they do hurt you. I believe it was Mickey Perry who made the decision to transfer in the middle of a semester. Instead of finishing it out academically, he just stopped going to classes and thus left in poor academic standing, which hurt UW's APR for a while.
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mrmike527
Travis is right, and additionally, any transfer in will count, but to a past "cohort" year. So if you started in the class of 2004 and you transferred to a new school in 2006, they would count you in your new school's "2004 cohort" statistics.

For those who are continuing to post individual players, I cannot take the time to go back and figure out to exactly which cohort year each player was assigned, see if they had a scholarship, or etc. The fact is that the article that was posted here is 100% correct, unless you think the NCAA itself is improperly tracking these people. Besides, if the Badgers did graduate one black player over that four-year period, is that somehow better? They still have a 40% graduation rate vs. 72% vs. the rest of the NCAA.

If you take pride in Wisconsin sports being a serious academic program for the athletes, then that's well-placed for the most part. The four year averages for football, track, and the category "other Men's sports" are all pretty close to the national average. For women's sports, they're better across the board.

But for Men's Basketball, they are embarrassingly bad. And as it relates to Diamond Stone, I'm not going to try to say he made his decision based on academics, it is ridiculous to see fans on this site and in other places suggesting that Stone is sacrificing academics to go to UM-College Park. College Park is actually a very good University, and over that same 4 year period that Wisconsin failed to graduate 60% of its basketball players, UM-CP is tied for best in the nation with 100%--every single player on the basketball team graduated.

If you're wondering "should I publicly criticize a high school senior for his decision to attend a college?" the answer is always no. But it's even worse when your criticism is totally off base, as it is in this case.
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mrmike527
kenny78 wrote:
As I see it, the problem is he used data that is 7-8 years old and made it sound like it is current. The most recent information on the NCAA site is for those attending from 2004-2007. The way his article reads he makes it sound like 40% is the current graduation rate. I don't think he knows what he is looking at.


I was confused for the same reason, I read the second document on each line (FGR report) and it's more clear.

That data is for the 2007 freshman cohort--that means all the players that start in 2007-2008. The data is completely up to date, because you are given 6 years to graduate your students. That means this report would be released after 2013-2014. Any player that graduated in the past 5 years would not be included, as they will be counted after 6 years (like the rest of the classes).

In other words, this is assessing players that would have been in the class of 2011, but may have graduated in 2012 or 2013. There were 0 black players in that class, so to say 0 of them graduated is somewhat misleading. However, in all four cohorts before that, not a single black basketball player graduated. To again say it in other words, any black basketball player who was recruited as part of the class of 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 or 2012 failed to graduate, even when given two additional years to do so. The rates for overall players is also bad, at 40%, which the author points out.

That is actually really, really awful. I know some people are pointing out they improved recently, but you pretty much have to improve when you are at 0. That's actually pretty shocking that Wisconsin had that awful a stretch at graduating basketball players.

The author of this article is completely correct, the senior classes from 2008-2012 were absolutely terrible at graduating Men's BB players.
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bp11
mrmike527 wrote:
Travis is right, and additionally, any transfer in will count, but to a past "cohort" year. So if you started in the class of 2004 and you transferred to a new school in 2006, they would count you in your new school's "2004 cohort" statistics.

For those who are continuing to post individual players, I cannot take the time to go back and figure out to exactly which cohort year each player was assigned, see if they had a scholarship, or etc. The fact is that the article that was posted here is 100% correct, unless you think the NCAA itself is improperly tracking these people. Besides, if the Badgers did graduate one black player over that four-year period, is that somehow better? They still have a 40% graduation rate vs. 72% vs. the rest of the NCAA.

If you take pride in Wisconsin sports being a serious academic program for the athletes, then that's well-placed for the most part. The four year averages for football, track, and the category "other Men's sports" are all pretty close to the national average. For women's sports, they're better across the board.

But for Men's Basketball, they are embarrassingly bad. And as it relates to Diamond Stone, I'm not going to try to say he made his decision based on academics, it is ridiculous to see fans on this site and in other places suggesting that Stone is sacrificing academics to go to UM-College Park. College Park is actually a very good University, and over that same 4 year period that Wisconsin failed to graduate 60% of its basketball players, UM-CP is tied for best in the nation with 100%--every single player on the basketball team graduated.

If you're wondering "should I publicly criticize a high school senior for his decision to attend a college?" the answer is always no. But it's even worse when your criticism is totally off base, as it is in this case.


Considering there were only two black players that didn't graduate, I'd say just graduating one black player would be pretty good.
Meatwad: It's like the Thunderdome in here. Only... Two men enter, no man leaves. Starring Mel Gibson... and Master Blaster.

"Where I'm from snitches get stitches." - Delonte West
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mrmike527
bp11 wrote:
mrmike527 wrote:
Travis is right, and additionally, any transfer in will count, but to a past "cohort" year. So if you started in the class of 2004 and you transferred to a new school in 2006, they would count you in your new school's "2004 cohort" statistics.

For those who are continuing to post individual players, I cannot take the time to go back and figure out to exactly which cohort year each player was assigned, see if they had a scholarship, or etc. The fact is that the article that was posted here is 100% correct, unless you think the NCAA itself is improperly tracking these people. Besides, if the Badgers did graduate one black player over that four-year period, is that somehow better? They still have a 40% graduation rate vs. 72% vs. the rest of the NCAA.

If you take pride in Wisconsin sports being a serious academic program for the athletes, then that's well-placed for the most part. The four year averages for football, track, and the category "other Men's sports" are all pretty close to the national average. For women's sports, they're better across the board.

But for Men's Basketball, they are embarrassingly bad. And as it relates to Diamond Stone, I'm not going to try to say he made his decision based on academics, it is ridiculous to see fans on this site and in other places suggesting that Stone is sacrificing academics to go to UM-College Park. College Park is actually a very good University, and over that same 4 year period that Wisconsin failed to graduate 60% of its basketball players, UM-CP is tied for best in the nation with 100%--every single player on the basketball team graduated.

If you're wondering "should I publicly criticize a high school senior for his decision to attend a college?" the answer is always no. But it's even worse when your criticism is totally off base, as it is in this case.


Considering there were only two black players that didn't graduate, I'd say just graduating one black player would be pretty good.


NCAA says 0% of 6-10 players graduated before subtracting out transfers and 0% of 1-5 after transfers so I assume there weren't 4+ transfers, but I guess I could be wrong.
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