mickjagger Show full post »
dawgstyle


Who are the legal experts you are citing?  The stuff I read about this being a TITLE 9 thing, were NOT written by legal experts. What legal experts can you cite?

Reminds me a bit of those saying John Brennan's 1st ammendment(freedom of speech) is being affected because Trump had his security clearance pulled. That has NO affect on Brennan's 1st ammendment rights - it didnt when he had the security clearance and it doesnt now that he has no security clearance.

Unless Smith's wife is a student, I cant see where TITLE 9 comes in. You remind me of Nancy Armore and her USA Newpaper columns - everything to her has TITLE 9 implications. Problem is if you read and understand TITLE 9, there is nothing written in text about how TITLE 9 can be used for non-students.

TITLE IX - (original text) part of the Education Amendments of 1972

"No person in in the United States, shall on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.

If you go on and read the entire explanation after the original text it says "sexual harassment and sexual violence against STUDENTS"

No where does a single word say anything about harassment by an employee against his wife.

Unless Smith's wife is a student, I (and many many of us) dont see how TITLE 9 affects this case(WITH WHAT WE KNOW AT THIS TIME).
I will 'give' there might be something we dont know that could 'kick in' TITLE 9, but right now there is nothing that bring TITLE 9 in.


Why don't you take 2 seconds to Google urban meyer and title IX?
@2GuysFromWI

Harbaugh will have Urban Meyer retired from OSU by 2020.
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blade12
Wondering if Chryst knew about Cephus' actions in April but never kicked him off the team until it was becoming public and he left the team?
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safetysqueezepleezzee11
dawgstyle wrote:


Why don't you take 2 seconds to Google urban meyer and title IX?


I heard the best explanation of the situation this am on ESPN radio by some attorney. He stated this: "Urban Meyer can be dismissed for violation of his CONTRACT, which has a clause in it that requires him to contact the TITLE 9 coordinator/compliance coordinator(or someone else in the OHS administration) about any situations of possible sexual harassment/etc. involving any students, faculty or staff."  The attorney went on to say it isnt a TITLE 9 violation on it's own. The clause hooks it to TITLE 9 and that is why so many are bouncing off walls that Urban Meyer violated TITLE 9. The attorney also went on to say he feels Meyer's wife may be in more trouble for this than Urban IF she didnt report it. This attorney didnt feel that Meyer's wife needed to tell Urban, but she needed to report the possible incident to the proper channels. That is interesting to me. Her employment contract apparently includes the same clause and this attorney felt that probably ALL employment contracts do at OHS. IF Urban Meyer also knew and didnt report it, he could certainly be in trouble, but it would be for violation of his CONTRACT and not a TITLE 9 violation. A subtle difference, but the attorney explained it pretty well. It is possible Urban's wife knew about it and didnt report it(or inform Urban)? - yes that is possible, but seems unlikely too. The attorney went on to discuss the importance of 'time lines' and how that may affect this case. He really got into the x's and o's and kind of lost me with the 'time line' stuff.

I initially questioned it because back in 1972, TITLE 9 was developed for STUDENTS only. The entire TITLE 9 and what it encompasses has gotten much more comprehensive since the original came out.

I dont rely on GOOLGE for my legal stuff/advice/explanation/etc - just too much garbage on GOOGLE.
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safetysqueezepleezzee11
blade12 wrote:
Wondering if Chryst knew about Cephus' actions in April but never kicked him off the team until it was becoming public and he left the team?


I would think that any interaction with the police by any athlete would  require the athlete too immediately inform the coach/administration. In today's world, whether the athlete is completely innocent or not; it would be in everyone's best interest to get this known to the coaches/administration as soon as possible. If it was me personally, I would go right to Chryst the same nite of the 'event'. Get it out there, especially if you are innocent. Perhaps this was reported well after the event and perhaps that is why it only came out now. At least Cephus came forward about it. 
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mickjagger
Ohio St suspends head coach Urban Meyer for the Buckeyes first 3 games of the 2018 season.  Athletic Director Gene Smith was also suspended.

Meyer admitted to lying about what he knew and when he knew it.  He claims he did eventually report the abuse by his ass't coach, Zach Smith.  to A.D. Gene Smith.  However, Meyer & G. Smith neglected to  report the abuse to University compliance officers, which they were required to do.

"Ohio State's Title IX sexual misconduct policy includes reporting allegations of domestic violence made against university employees. Violating that policy allows Meyer to be fired with cause, according to provisions placed in his contract when it was extended in April by two years. The deal through 2022 increased Meyer's salary to $7.6 million in 2018, with annual 6 percent raises. Meyer has about $38 million left on his contract."
 - Associated Press

Meyer will miss Ohio State's games against Oregon State, Rutgers and No. 16 TCU, though he will be allowed to coach practices leading up to the Rutgers and TCU games.

IMO, all things considered, right now I believe Meyer is getting off quite easily.  I think allowing Meyer to coach his team during the weeks leading up to the 2nd & 3rd games of the suspensions is far too lenient. 

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/ohio-state-suspends-meyer-for-first-3-games/ar-BBMhISY
Wisconsin Sports Network Hall of Fame Inductee, 2012
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dawgstyle
The media is having a field day with this decision.  It will be interesting to see where this goes. 
@2GuysFromWI

Harbaugh will have Urban Meyer retired from OSU by 2020.
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db11
dawgstyle wrote:
The media is having a field day with this decision.  It will be interesting to see where this goes. 


The quotes about memory loss are something else.
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blade12
I thought there would be more chatter on this today. I guess we move on to the next "crisis du jour.
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ash22themagnificent
I don't speak out on incidents like this, but both stories certainly cast a shadow over Ohio State and Maryland and it's not the so kind type.  The lack of leadership in both matters is unsettling if not worse.
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safetysqueezepleezzee11
Anyone hear what Urban Meyer's wife got out of this?  If she was an employee of OHS, she was apparently required to contact someone that looks into this kind of stuff.  Looks like the athletic director and Urban Meyer got some discipline. Why wouldnt Meyer's wife get disciplined if she actually texted with the 'victim'. Also was wondering if Smith ever got charged for domestic abuse? The way I have heard and read things, he was never charged. I have seen where he denied it on TV. This entire situation with Smith seems weird. Why Urban Meyer brought him to OHS is puzzling to me, even if Bruce was the guy's grandfather.  To me, that is the dumbest thing Urban Meyer did. Appears Urban Meyer must have contacted the athletic director, so it makes me wonder why the athletic director didnt 'push' this up the chain? I dont give Urban Meyer a pass, but many seem insinuate(the media primarily) that Urban Meyer did nothing. Who told the athletic director? I havent had time to read the 23 page report and I honestly dont think that report will answer my questions. As far as Urban Meyer 'lying' to the media - I say props to him for that as I have little regard for almost any media as the days go by.
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mickjagger
I watched the entire OSU  press conference - twice !

2 things stand out ... every OSU official who spoke, along with Urban Meyer himself, admitted that Meyer was in the loop on the 2009, 2015 and 2018 Zach Smith incidents and yet "misrepresented the facts" at the recent 2018 Big 10 Football media event.  But then each of these people (including Meyer), in their next sentences, claim that Meyer did not intend to deliberately lie."   How does one  knowingly misrepresent the facts without deliberately lying?

Also, not one speaker (the investigating committee chairman  Mary Jo White, the OSU president Michael Drake, OSU A.D. Gene Smith. nor Urban Meyer) ever mentioned, expressed concern or apologized to Courtney Smith for their neglect in monitoring and/or reporting the incidents.  The only apologies were to the school & "Buckeye Nation" for letting them down.  Really?  Seriously?   Finally, the last question from the media asked if Meyer "had anything to say to  Courtney Smith."  Meyer took the question & deflected it away by saying "I have a message for everyone involved in this, I'm sorry we're in this situation" ...  without being specific or ever mentioning Courtney Smith's name.
Wisconsin Sports Network Hall of Fame Inductee, 2012
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mickjagger
mickjagger wrote:
I watched the entire OSU  press conference - twice !

2 things stand out ... every OSU official who spoke, along with Urban Meyer himself, admitted that Meyer was in the loop on the 2009, 2015  and 2018 Zach Smith incidents and yet "misrepresented the facts" at the recent 2018 Big 10 Football media event.  But then each of these people (including Meyer), in their next sentences.  claim that Meyer did not intend to deliberately lie."   How does one knowingly misrepresent the facts without deliberately lying?

Also, not one speaker (the investigating committee chairman Mary Jo White, the OSU president Michael Drake, OSU A.D. Gene Smith, nor Urban Meyer) ever mentioned, expressed concern or apologized to Courtney Smith for their neglect in monitoring and/or reporting the incidents.  The only apologies were to the school & "Buckeye Nation" for letting them down.  Really?  Seriously?   Finally, the last question from the media asked if Meyer "had anything to say to Courtney Smith."  Meyer took the question and  deflected it away by saying, "I have a message for everyone involved in this, I'm sorry we're in this situation" ...  without being specific or ever mentioning Courtney Smith's name.
"Number 1 - 2018 will go down for me as the year we just decided we're just not gonna use the word 'lie' anymore. And we're gonna call it all kinds of other things. He lied. He didn't misrepresent the facts. He wasn't less than accurate. You lied and you can just call it lying. Why we've decided as media and a society to just kind of walk around that so very softly - you're a liar. You lied. Period. Done."
 
- Michelle Beadle, ESPN Anchor
 
I agree with Ms. Beadle.
 
Suspended Ohio St football coach Urban Meyer's press conference on Wednesday was a sham !
Wisconsin Sports Network Hall of Fame Inductee, 2012
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mickjagger
mickjagger wrote:
I watched the entire OSU  press conference - twice !

2 things stand out ... every OSU official who spoke, along with Urban Meyer himself, admitted that Meyer was in the loop on the 2009, 2015 and 2018 Zach Smith incidents and yet "misrepresented the facts" at the recent 2018 Big 10 Football media event.  But then each of these people  (including Meyer), in their next sentences, claim that Meyer "did not intend to deliberately lie."   How does one knowingly misrepresent the facts without deliberately lying?

Also, not one speaker (the investigating committee chairman Mary Jo White, the OSU president Micheal Drake, OSU A.D. Gene Smith, nor Urban Meyer) ever mentioned, expressed concern or apologized to Courtney Smith for their neglect in monitoring and/or reporting the incidents.  The only apologies were to the school & "Buckeye Nation" for letting them down.  Really?  Seriously?   Finally, the last question from the media the media asked if Meyer "had anything to say to Courtney Smith."  Meyer took the question and  deflected it away by saying, "I have a message for everyone involved in this, I'm sorry we're in this situation" ...  without being specific or ever mentioning Courtney Smith's name.
mickjagger wrote:
"Number 1 - 2018 will go down for me as the year we just decided we're just not gonna use the word 'lie' anymore. And we're gonna call it all kinds of other things. He lied. He didn't misrepresent the facts. He wasn't less than accurate. You lied and you can just call it lying. Why we've decided as media and a society to just kind of walk around that so very softly - you're a liar. You lied. Period. Done."
 
- Michelle Beadle, ESPN Anchor
 
I agree with Ms. Beadle.
 
Suspended Ohio St football coach Urban Meyer's press conference on Wednesday was a sham !
A damning feature article by Sports Illustrated on Ohio State University's numerous failures in the Zach Smith case.

Very in-depth & revealing:
https://www.si.com/college-football/2018/08/23/ohio-state-urban-meyer-failures-zach-smith-investigation?utm_campaign=si-extra&utm_source=si.com&utm_medium=email&utm_content=2018082312PM&eminfo=%7b%22EMAIL%22%3a%22yEegR3N41GrUE6FY3ua1C6yTrkkPMrpS%22%2c%22BRAND%22%3a%22SI%22%2c%22CONTENT%22%3a%22Newsletter%22%2c%22UID%22%3a%22SI_EXT_5AEF8C93-4C7A-4AC3-B1D7-B61D693569BA%22%2c%22SUBID%22%3a%2298873864%22%2c%22JOBID%22%3a%22860713%22%2c%22NEWSLETTER%22%3a%22SI_EXTRA%22%2c%22ZIP%22%3a%22%22%2c%22COUNTRY%22%3a%22CAN%22%7d 
Wisconsin Sports Network Hall of Fame Inductee, 2012
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safetysqueezepleezzee11
mickjagger wrote:
"Number 1 - 2018 will go down for me as the year we just decided we're just not gonna use the word 'lie' anymore. And we're gonna call it all kinds of other things. He lied. He didn't misrepresent the facts. He wasn't less than accurate. You lied and you can just call it lying. Why we've decided as media and a society to just kind of walk around that so very softly - you're a liar. You lied. Period. Done."
 
- Michelle Beadle, ESPN Anchor
 
I agree with Ms. Beadle.
 
Suspended Ohio St football coach Urban Meyer's press conference on Wednesday was a sham !


Beadle is either incredibly nieve or just stupid if she honestly thinks this type 'lying' started this year(2018).  Perhaps she has never read any history. It has been going on in politics forever and business for at least the 50 years I have been involved in business. Sports just mimics society and vice versa. FDR, JFK, LBJ, Nixon, Reagan, Bill Clinton, Obama and now Trump have all been caught blatantly lying and found ways to weasel out of it by 'using' words or phrases. I lived thru the 1960's, so absolutely NOTHING surprises me anymore. Sports is no different than REAL life - bad things happen and people make poor choices. That isnt going to change no matter how many stupid "hashtag" lines of rubbish are put out there.

I do admit I am disappointed that Urban Meyer didnt just admit what he knew and when he knew it, but it doesnt surprise me that he didnt. Had he told the truth and took the heat, i doubt he would have gotten fired and would have probably gotten some 'cred' for manning up. In my nearly 73 years on this earth, I have seen less and less personal responsibility as time goes on.  People seem to always get real 'huffy' when a person that wins or is successful makes mistakes and lies, but it is common in all parts of society from the dregs at the bottom to the most successful. Unfortunately, I dont see that improving - I actually seeing it just continuing to get worse.
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mickjagger
mickjagger wrote:
I watched the entire OSU  press conference - twice !

2 things stand out ... every OSU official who spoke, along with Urban Meyer himself, admitted that Meyer was in the loop on the 2009, 2015 and 2018 Zach Smith incidents and yet "misrepresented the facts" at the recent 2018 Big 10 Football media event.  But then each of these people (including Meyer), in their next sentences, claim that Meyer did not intend to deliberately lie."   How does one  knowingly misrepresent the facts without deliberately lying?

Also, not one speaker (the investigating committee chairman  Mary Jo White, the OSU president Michael Drake, OSU A.D. Gene Smith. nor Urban Meyer) ever mentioned, expressed concern or apologized to Courtney Smith for their neglect in monitoring and/or reporting the incidents.  The only apologies were to the school & "Buckeye Nation" for letting them down.  Really?  Seriously?   Finally, the last question from the media asked if Meyer "had anything to say to  Courtney Smith."  Meyer took the question & deflected it away by saying "I have a message for everyone involved in this, I'm sorry we're in this situation" ...  without being specific or ever mentioning Courtney Smith's name.
Urban Meyer finally did the right thing:  he explicitly apologized to Courtney Smith for his lack of oversight in the matter of her now ex-husband's almost decade-long history of domestic abuse. 

"He struck a more contrite tone in a statement posted Friday to his Twitter account, with a direct apology to Smith 'and her children for what they have gone through.' ”

“ 'My words and demeanor on Wednesday did not show how seriously I take relationship violence. I sincerely apologize,' read Meyer’s statement"

- USA Today Sports

Full Story:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/urban-meyers-late-apology-to-courtney-smith-implies-some-willingness-to-take-responsibility/ar-BBMoO7X
Wisconsin Sports Network Hall of Fame Inductee, 2012
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